cleaning .22
G. Michael Paine
necessary or even advisable to run brushes through the barrel. The
reason being that the wax from the bullet coats the barrel and there
fore prevents build-up as with other ammo.
I have a new MKII and would like to keep it in the best possible
condition.
-M.P.
-----------------------------------------------------------
Learn about rec.guns at http://www.recguns.com
-----------------------------------------------------------
Dan Asper
good, just run a patch through the bore, from the chamber end.
Dan Asper
Columbus, OH
G. Michael Paine <mick...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:as3t5p$s0j$1...@grapevine.wam.umd.edu...
> ...
Randy Wakeman
#necessary or even advisable to run brushes through the barrel.
You must be joking.
Randy Wakeman
Ragnar
"G. Michael Paine" <mick...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:as3t5p$s0j$1...@grapevine.wam.umd.edu...
# necessary or even advisable to run brushes through the barrel. The
# reason being that the wax from the bullet coats the barrel and there
# fore prevents build-up as with other ammo.
You've been told wrong. Not all .22 ammo is "waxed". As long as you're
careful running a cleaning brush down the barrel isn't a problem. Read the
MKII manual and see if it says "don't use a brush".
Ragnar
Charlie
"G. Michael Paine" <mick...@earthlink.net> wrote:
# I have been told that since .22 cal ammo is waxed that it is not
# necessary or even advisable to run brushes through the barrel. The
# reason being that the wax from the bullet coats the barrel and there
# fore prevents build-up as with other ammo.
I go along with that. More .22RFs have been damaged from improper
cleaning than no cleaning.
Clean only from the breech using a rod guide or use a pull through.
Clean the barrel only when accuracy deteriorates.
Above is for general shooting. High accuracy target people use
"witchcraft" cleaning regimens and usually clean when switching brands
and types of ammo.
--
Charlie Dilks
Newark, DE USA
KCOM
On 27-Nov-2002, "G. Michael Paine" <mick...@earthlink.net> wrote:
# I have been told that since .22 cal ammo is waxed that it is not
# necessary or even advisable to run brushes through the barrel. The
# reason being that the wax from the bullet coats the barrel and there
# fore prevents build-up as with other ammo.
A nylon type bore brush wouldn't hurt.
--
Steve
Ralph Mowery
# Clean the barrel only when accuracy deteriorates.
#
# Above is for general shooting. High accuracy target people use
# "witchcraft" cleaning regimens and usually clean when switching brands
# and types of ammo.
The centerfire rifles are cleaned very often, but the very high dollar
target 22 rifles are seldom cleaned. Unless maybe changing brands or types
of ammo.
For the automatic 22s you do need to keep the action clean. If it is not
shot very often, then a wet patch or two followed by a dry patch down the
barrle is fine. Just don;t use the brass brush (never the stainless steel
brush) very often.
Bob S.
#From: "G. Michael Paine"
#I have been told that since .22 cal ammo is waxed..............
Try this little item, it's cheap and works like a charm.
It's called "The Patch Worm".
http://20-20.8m.com/products.html#patchworm
"Gun Bans don't disarm criminals, gun bans ATTRACT them." -Walter Mondale
Paul W. Ross
over the place in a Mk. II -- in the action, into the bolt face, etc.,
etc. I am a proponent of "Ed's Red" for cleaning. A couple of swipes
down the barrel, and some work with a small brush is sufficient for
most cleaning. About every 5 times I have mine out for shooting, I
pull it apart and hose the inside down with brake cleaner or the like,
clean everything good, re-oil. I like Breakfree CLP, then put back
together. Cleaning also gives me an opportunity to check functioning,
any problems, etc. I use mine for bullseye competition, and you do not
need a jam, etc., during a match. ALso, make it a point to clean the
firing pin channel, which seems to crud up.
Marty
is benign enough that one can get by with very little cleaning.
However, if one waits until accuracy deteriorates, or the gun ceases to
function as is sometimes stated, large enough amounts of crud have to be
accumulating to damage moving metal parts and increase bore wear. I'm
am of the old school. I clean my pistols after every shooting session.
My father's old .22 rifle has been cleaned thousands of times over the
last 70 years, and it still shoots great. I think the main thing here
is to use some care... clean from the breech if possible, being very
careful around the muzzle. Careless cleaning can be just as bad or
worse than too little.
Marty
D. J. Dorn
had a brush through it - only a solvent patch now and then for powder
fouling. It's never suffered accuracy and it can still hit an asprin 3 out
of 5 t5imes at 50 yds. (Benched with a 15x scope of course)
Don
"G. Michael Paine" <mick...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:as3t5p$s0j$1...@grapevine.wam.umd.edu...
> ...
-----------------------------------------------------------
Charles Winters
waxed or un waxed. I'm surprised you didn't get more response. I'm not
a big .22 shooter since you can't reload the little buggers.
Accordingly I'm not one of those competitive shooters who faces this
dilemma with his/her .22 pistol or rifle.
However, from what I gather, these people don't clean their barrels very
often. Some claim to go thousands of rounds between cleanings. For
some reason, probably due to the low velocity and soft bullets, .22
rimfire barrels don't accumulate fouling the same way high power rounds
to. Especially if you have a bolt action or single shot rifle, fouling
in the action is nil. Once you do clean the bore, you have to start all
over again with conditioning until things settle down. In my
experience, this only takes 10 rounds or so, but maybe for competitors
its more troublesome.
In summary, you can easily let your bore go for long periods between
cleanings. When the time comes, normal solvent, brushes and patches
will do the trick with no harm, so long as you are careful with the
crown and don't overdo it. You should keep any eye on any fouling build
up inside the action of your Ruger and deal with that when it becomes a
problem for reliable funtioning. - CW
"G. Michael Paine" wrote:
> ...
Dennis Moore
won't believe it.
Would it interest you to know that the owner's manual for Anschutz
rifles tells you to run two clean dry patches down the bore to remove
loose fouling after each session. To follow that with an oiled patch
if the rifle will be stored without use. And not to otherwise clean.
Brushes certainly do not seem to be needed on .22LR firearms.
When interested in accuracy, cleaning will help somewhat. Though
most good firearms in .22 seem to deteriorate a little and then
not get any worse. The few I have owned seemed to need cleaning
about every 300 rounds for top accuracy. The cleaning would consist
of using Hoppes or a similar solvent on a jag, but not a brush.
Where you will need a brush is the chamber. A lead ring will eventually
build up there and diminish accuracy. So lightly brushing
that area every 500 to 1000 rounds is desirable.
Even bulk pack ammo from Walmart etc. has some lube. It may
be hard and not obvious the way some of the waxy or oily lubes
of target ammo is. But it is there. That combined with the low
pressures involved with .22 ammo means cleaning needs are quite
different from centerfire ammo.
On automatics you will need to of course remove the gunk from the
parts of the weapon besides the barrel. But an occasional running
of the solvent through the bore will be plenty good enough.
kaboom
blueing solution. The bore wasn't effected by the chemical in any way. I now
don't even oil the bore. If the wax can hold off against blueing, it'll be able
to hold off against rust.
> ...
Randy Wakeman
#
#--
#Steve
Agreed. Most folks rarely clean their .22's, because it is a bit of a pain.
Much .22 RF ammo is copper washed (I hesitate to call it plated, as it is so
thin) that cuts down on barrel leading a bit.
The notion that a periodic cleaning with a brass brush is harmful has no merit.
By wax, I would guess the original poster is referring to the lubed lead rounds
offered by Remington and others.
In any case, many makers recommend the use of a brush.
In the Ruger 10/22 manual, pages 17-18:
"Then attach a solvent-wetted bristle brush to the rod and run it back and
forth the full length of the bore as many times as necessary to remove grease
and dirt from the bore and chamber."
Randy Wakeman
Doug White
In article <as3t5p$s0j$1...@grapevine.wam.umd.edu>, "G. Michael Paine" <mick...@earthlink.net> wrote:
#I have been told that since .22 cal ammo is waxed that it is not
#necessary or even advisable to run brushes through the barrel. The
#reason being that the wax from the bullet coats the barrel and there
#fore prevents build-up as with other ammo.
#
#I have a new MKII and would like to keep it in the best possible
#condition.
Modern .22 ammo is clean enough & lubed enough that the bore hardly ever
needs more than a swabbing out with a patch. The problem is that the
chamber will get dirty, which will result in malfunctions. Use a .25
caliber bore brush or a fat .22 bore brush (Outers are slightly larger
than the nominal chamber dimensions, many other aren't) and only insert
it far enough to clean out the chamber. If it goes into the actual bore,
it will crush the fibers slightly, and it won't clean out the chamber as
well.
Because you NEVER want to clean a pistol from the muzzle, you now have
lots of chamber debris you have to get out of the bore that you can't
easily just push back out of the chamber. A rod with a patch & a light
bore cleaner will do, or you can use a pull through to sweep the debris
out the muzzle. I haven't run a brush down a rim fire barrel in decades.
I have a High Standard .22 with about 100,000 rounds through it, and it
will still shoot a perfect score if I do my part. This is with good
quality standard velocity ammo, nothing fancy or expensive. After about
50,000 rounds, I did use Lead-Away patch material, and it _might_ have
gotten a little bit of crud out of the grooves. I was having a slight
problem with occasional keyholing, but I suspect it was the ammo, which
had always been a little marginal.
Doug White
Rodney
# # necessary or even advisable to run brushes through the barrel. The
# # reason being that the wax from the bullet coats the barrel and there
# # fore prevents build-up as with other ammo.
#
# A nylon type bore brush wouldn't hurt.
More 22 LR's barrels are worn out today by cleaning than not cleaning them
The damage is done with the "rod" not the brush
#
--
Rodney Long,
Inventor of the
Boomerang Fishing Pro.
http://ezknot.com/Boomerang.htm
& EZKnot http://ezknot.com/ezknottyer.htm
KCOM
On 28-Nov-2002, "Ragnar" <rwo...@earthlink.net> wrote:
# You've been told wrong. Not all .22 ammo is "waxed". As long as you're
# careful running a cleaning brush down the barrel isn't a problem. Read
# the
# MKII manual and see if it says "don't use a brush".
#
# Ragnar
How can one argue with the manufacturer? :^)
--
Steve
Noah Yetter
the bullet wax protects the bore, so why bother? I suppose I might clean
them once after I finish this box of Federal copper-coated stuff, but after
that I'm sticking to plain waxed lead, and don't expect to clean them for a
long time.
Noah
Ralph Mowery
#
# In any case, many makers recommend the use of a brush.
#
# In the Ruger 10/22 manual, pages 17-18:
#
# "Then attach a solvent-wetted bristle brush to the rod and run it back and
# forth the full length of the bore as many times as necessary to remove
grease
# and dirt from the bore and chamber."
#
There is a big differance in a $ 150 10/22 and a $ 1000+ target rifle.
Rugers have never been very accurate anyway. Maybe putting that brass brush
through them will help smooth out the rough spots in the bore :-)
Ragnar
"KCOM" <kc...@cotse.net> wrote in message
news:asaqgi$6t6$1...@grapevine.wam.umd.edu...
## # You've been told wrong. Not all .22 ammo is "waxed". As long as you're
# # careful running a cleaning brush down the barrel isn't a problem. Read
# # the
# # MKII manual and see if it says "don't use a brush".
# #
# # Ragnar
#
# How can one argue with the manufacturer? :^)
In this case, I would believe the manufacturer before I would believe a
random guy's advice.
dadof3
Go invest in a Boresnake. It is a rope, sized for the specific
caliber, with a small bronze brush right in it. There's a smaller
rope/string attached to feed easily down the barrel. The caliber-size
rope does the cleaning as it's pulled through the barrel. It makes
cleaning a .22 a pleasant chore. Cleaning a .22 with a rod and a patch
SUCKS! I think that's why most people don't clean them.
Randy Wakeman
#Rugers have never been very accurate anyway. Maybe putting that brass brush
#through them will help smooth out the rough spots in the bore :-)
Browning recommends intermittent use of a brass brush as well, as do other
makers.
As to Rugers "never" being accurate, you need to shoot mine.
Randy Wakeman
KCOM
On 30-Nov-2002, "Ralph Mowery" <rmo...@ctc.net> wrote:
# The centerfire rifles are cleaned very often,
#
Yes, and that's where such things as the ammonia based copper solvents and
the Outer's Foul Out (I,II, & III) units come in. I have .22 high volocity
centerfire rifles and I use both on them.
--
Steve
Randy Wakeman
#centerfire rifles and I use both on them.
#
#--
#Steve
Hi Steve,
Please tell me more obout your experience the Outers Foul Out Systems!
Thank you,
Randy
Randy Wakeman
Harvey4066
the thing. Otherwise I kept putting it off.
Harvey C. Scobie
Radcliff, KY
Rigger
<mjo...@cableone.net> wrote:
# Cleaning a .22 with a rod and a patch SUCKS!
Not if you get the correct rod & patch.
--
Dave Vick
NRA, MCRGO
Tank: "Okay; whaddya need... Besides a miracle?"
Neo: "Guns... Lots of guns."
KCOM
On 30-Nov-2002, "Ragnar" <rwo...@earthlink.net> wrote:
# In this case, I would believe the manufacturer before I would believe a
# random guy's advice.
Errr... I was agreeing with the manufacturer.
--
Steve
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KCOM
On 1-Dec-2002, mjo...@cableone.net (dadof3) wrote:
# Go invest in a Boresnake.
The cleaning kits sold by Otis http://www.otisgun.com are much superior to
the bore snake IMHO.
--
Steve
KCOM
On 1-Dec-2002, randy...@aol.com (Randy Wakeman) wrote:
# Please tell me more obout your experience the Outers Foul Out Systems!
Well it takes longer to clean with than advertised but it's the most
effective copper remover I've ever used. Acetone (as recommended by
rec.guns poster Ken Marsh) seems to be the best degreaser to use. Finally,
Bore Tech Moly Magic http://www.boretech.com seems to work as the best
*conventional bore cleaner/solvent* for the conventional cleanings between
FO runs. HTH.
--
Steve
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Randy Wakeman
#effective copper remover I've ever used. Acetone (as recommended by
#rec.guns poster Ken Marsh) seems to be the best degreaser to use. Finally,
#Bore Tech Moly Magic http://www.boretech.com seems to work as the best
#*conventional bore cleaner/solvent* for the conventional cleanings between
#FO runs. HTH.
#
#--
#Steve
#
Thanks, Steve !
Randy Wakeman
Ken Marsh
Boy's .22 rimfires are made with a softer steel than centerfire rifles.
It makes the manufacturing process easier and cheaper. As a result, one
MUST be more careful when using a rod to clean a .22LR rifle bore. It is
very easy to gouge the rifling, scratch the bore, and grind down the
crown.
All .22LR ammo is either waxed, or has some kind of external bullet
coating for lubrication. .22WMR (magnum) does not, it operates the same
as centerfire .22's, relying on a guilding metal jacketed bullet.
As for cleaning, there's been some discussion on this since the recent
popularity of 22 rimfire benchrest. Some buildup around the chamber
mouth is considered good for accuracy, but when it gets to the point that
it is hard to insert a cartridge, it should be cleaned. Some clean only
the chamber, some the whole barrel.
Here's a post where noted barrel maker Gale McMillan, a subscriber
to the "clean it" theory, mentions other rimfire luminaries who
didn't clean their barrels, Art Cook and Lone Wiggers. Wiggers came
around to his way of thinking, Cook didn't...
http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=69rdpc%247fd%40xring.cs.umd.edu&oe=UTF-8&output=gplain
Ken.
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Opt-out options are not an | Mail: kmarsh at charm dot net
acceptable excuse for Spam. | WWW: http://www.charm.net/~kmarsh
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
KCOM
On 2-Dec-2002, randy...@aol.com (Randy Wakeman) wrote:
# Finally,
# #Bore Tech Moly Magic http://www.boretech.com seems to work as the best
# #*conventional bore cleaner/solvent* for the conventional cleanings
# between
# #FO runs. HTH.
# #
# #--
# #Steve
# #
#
# Thanks, Steve !
What I did not mention and I should have is that I only use the Bore Tech
Moly Magic as a powder remover when using the Outer's Foul Out III system.
If I'm not using the FO, I usually use another Bore Cleaner like M Pro 7,
Butch's Bore Shine, one of the many types of Shooter's Choice bore cleaners,
RB-17, Tetragun copper solvent, and a trillion others.
--
Steve
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Hoppy
"dadof3" <mjo...@cableone.net> wrote in message
news:asdjnc$7ad$1...@grapevine.wam.umd.edu...
# By now you've heard lots of advice but I did not see this....
#
# Go invest in a Boresnake. It is a rope, sized for the specific
# caliber, with a small bronze brush right in it. There's a smaller
# rope/string attached to feed easily down the barrel. The caliber-size
# rope does the cleaning as it's pulled through the barrel. It makes
# cleaning a .22 a pleasant chore. Cleaning a .22 with a rod and a patch
# SUCKS! I think that's why most people don't clean them.
Or get a piece of the largest Weed Eater string about six feet long. Hammer
the center flat for about an inch then make a slit with an Exacto knife and
thread a patch through it. Feed the line into either end of the barrel and
pull back and forth.
--
Hoppy
BS7 AH85 SENS
hoppy at crpud dot net
KCOM
#
#
# Or get a piece of the largest Weed Eater string about six feet
long. Hammer
# the center flat for about an inch then make a slit with an Exacto
knife and
# thread a patch through it. Feed the line into either end of the
barrel and
# pull back and forth.
#
#
I can see how that would work. But going in one direction only is
better, and that direction should be from breech to muzzle. However,
there are good cleaning kits on the market by Otis
http://www.otisgun.com that would be much better IMHO.
--
Steve
.
Charlie
# Or get a piece of the largest Weed Eater string about six feet
# knife and thread a patch through it. Feed the line into either end of the
# barrel and pull back and forth.
"KCOM" <kc...@cotse.net> wrote:
# I can see how that would work. But going in one direction only is
# better, and that direction should be from breech to muzzle. However,
# there are good cleaning kits on the market by Otis
# http://www.otisgun.com that would be much better IMHO.
I use an Otis for larger than .22 and love it.
For .177s and .22s I went a little better by heating the weed eater line
first and squishing it in a vice. When I had tried just pounding it it
had fractures in it. The thickness of the jaws was just about right
(around an inch).
Following a suggestion I read on an airgun forum I squeezed it again
around 1/2" from the first squeeze and at a right angle to it. I also
embellished it by poking a hot ice pick through the slits at each end.
This relieves any stresses that might fracture and makes holes so you
get a wider slit in my later operation. . Then I smoothed and further
widened the slits with an emery board. This makes inserting the patches
much easier.
The double patches make things go twice as fast. Cleaner on the lead
patch and a dry one following. As many times as needed, then two dry
ones, then an oily lead with a dry following.
I agree with the breech to muzzle only.
--
Charlie Dilks
Newark, DE USA
G. Michael Paine
"KCOM" <kc...@cotse.net> wrote:
# I can see how that would work. But going in one direction only is
# better, and that direction should be from breech to muzzle. However,
# there are good cleaning kits on the market by Otis
# http://www.otisgun.com that would be much better IMHO.
#
I am curious. Why is it better to move the cleaning items from breach to
muzzle? I have noticed a few warning about staying away from the muzzle.
-M.P.
KCOM
On 7-Dec-2002, "G. Michael Paine" <mick...@earthlink.net> wrote:
# I am curious. Why is it better to move the cleaning items from breach to
# muzzle? I have noticed a few warning about staying away from the muzzle.
You can damage the crown on the muzzle
--
Steve
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KCOM
On 7-Dec-2002, Charlie <cdi...@bellatlantic.net> wrote:
# I use an Otis for larger than .22 and love it
Glad to see someone else likes the otis kits also. ;-)
--
Steve
Kenneth Coney
"G. Michael Paine" wrote:
> ...